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A Conversation on Plant Intelligence

A conversation with Craig Holdrege, Jon McAlice, and John Gouldthorpe

As a companion to the previous episode that shared a reading of Jon McAlice’s and Craig Holdrege’s article on plant intelligence, this episode airs a conversation with Jon, Craig, and podcast host John Gouldthorpe on this complex topic.

Are Plants Intelligent?

An audio article by Craig Holdrege and Jon McAlice

A reading of the article “Are Plants Intelligent?” by Craig Holdrege and Jon McAlice (from the Spring 2024 issue of In Context) is featured in this episode. This article is the first to arise out of our current research into the complex topic of assigning intelligence to organisms.

Two Moons?
An audio article by Martin Wagenschein

In a reading of Martin Wagenschein’s essay “Two Moons?” he contrasts the view of the physicist versus the poet when considering the moon. You can read the article here.

The Wisdom of Plants
A talk by Craig Holdrege

In a talk recorded at the institute, Craig Holdrege honors Earth Day with a presentation revealing some of the remarkable qualities of the plant world, the “mantle of the earth.”

Craig showed slides to illustrate certain points. The images are not necessary to appreciate the talk, but they can be downloaded here if desired or you can watch a slideshow synced with the audio here.

Living in the Present: Practices for Being In and With Nature
A talk by Ryan Shea

In this recorded live talk at the institute, Ryan Shea explores ways in which we might receive the capacity of presence directly from nature by working with lessons from plant and animal teachers.

On Goethe and His Science
An interview with Henrike and Craig Holdrege

In a rare interview, recorded in Brazil in 2019, Henrike and Craig speak of their transformative work, and the Goethean perspective that has long inspired it. You can also watch the interview here.

Where Does an Animal End? — The American Bison (Part 3)
A reading and conversation with Craig Holdrege

The final installment of our 3-part podcast on the American bison, Craig’s reading focuses on the animal as a many-layered being with a web of both physical boundaries and expansive living relations. The bison is more than a  thing among things. A discussion follows the reading.

Where Does an Animal End? — The American Bison (Part 2)
A reading and conversation with Craig Holdrege

Following up on the bison’s manifold ways of being, highlighted in Part 1, this second episode portrays the relationship between the members of the Great Plains tribes and the bison. It offers glimpses of the continuity that can be experienced between a being’s physical and spiritual life.

Where Does an Animal End? — The American Bison (Part 1)
A reading and conversation with Craig Holdrege

Here is Part 1 of our three-episode podcast based on Craig Holdrege’s in-depth article, “Where Does an Animal End? — The American Bison” which first appeared in issue #45 of In Context, our biannual publication. Each of the three parts feature a reading from the article followed by a conversation with the author. Part 2 will air in November, followed by Part 3 in December.

Two Kinds of Darkness
A conversation with Henrike Holdrege

The Nature Institute co-founder and educator Henrike Holdrege joins podcast host John Gouldthorpe to discuss a unique demonstration she employs to develop a more nuanced understanding of the interplay of light, darkness, and matter.

Experience, Imagination & the Nature of Meaning
A talk by Jon McAlice

In a talk recorded at the institute in April 2023, Jon McAlice briefly traces the philosophical history of human relation to meaning in the natural world through the ideas of various 18th century thinkers. Jon then arrives at his central theme: In a world increasingly objectified by science and technology, are there ways of being that allow us to experience the presence of meaning in the natural world?  Jon created an accompanying handout of a hornbeam tree to compliment this talk.

Where Do Organisms End?
A reading by Craig Holdrege & a conversation between John Gouldthorpe and Craig

Welcome to our two-part episode. First, we share a recording of Craig Holdrege reading his essay, “Where Do Organisms End?” (which first appeared in our third issue of In Context). Following this, our podcast host John Gouldthorpe and Craig discuss challenging our habitual way of making sense of living beings through their physical characteristics, and instead by way of their relationships.

Appreciating Barry Lopez
A talk by Jon McAlice

From a talk recorded at the institute in November, Jon McAlice takes us through the biography and works of award-winning writer Barry Lopez, whose life was defined by a profound connection to the more-than-human world. Lopez died in 2020, bequeathing us a trove of essays, fiction, and non-fiction that invites all to understand and enjoy nature as he did — as alive and responsive.

Toward a Participative Science
Remarks by Arthur Zajonc & a conversation between John Gouldthorpe and Elaine Khosrova

Featuring the reading of remarks from a 2003 interview on Goethean science with Arthur Zajonc, professor emeritus of physics at Amherst College, this episode also includes a conversation about Zajonc’s central points between podcast host and institute educator, John Gouldthorpe, and Elaine Khosrova, editor of the institute’s publication, In Context.

Portraying Milkweed
A recorded article by Craig Holdrege

Here we bring our focus to a plant that Craig Holdrege describes as both “effusive, yet also specialized. Milkweed invites life, but also holds it back. There is a fascinating tension in this plant.” Reading from an abridged version of his whole-organism study of milkweed published on our website (“The Story of an Organism: Common Milkweed”), Craig brings together his observations with those of other researchers to paint a vibrant picture of the plant and its relationships.

Do Frogs Come from Tadpoles?
A talk by Craig Holdrege

When we give careful attention to what is actually happening when a new phase of life develops out of a previous stage, there are large implications for our overall understanding of developmental processes and evolution. That is the theme of Craig’s lecture, “Do Frogs Come from Tadpoles?,” featured in this episode of our podcast. Link here for the accompanying illustrations that Craig refers to during the talk.

Being with the World: A Path to Qualitative Insight
A talk by Craig Holdrege (2022)

At the 2022 Annual International Conference of Biodynamic Agriculture in Dornach, Switzerland, institute director Craig Holdrege gave a keynote talk on the qualitative experience of nature as a conscious practice. Sharing a qualitative approach to nature has been at the core of The Nature Institute's work since 1998. We feature much of Craig’s talk in this episode.

How Does a Mole View the World?
Craig Holdrege in conversation with John Gouldthorpe

Can we imagine the world from a mole’s perspective? In our latest podcast episode, host John Gouldthorpe invites us to understand what this might entail by listening to a reading of Craig Holdrege’s book excerpt, “How Does a Mole View the World.” The reading is followed by a conversation with Craig about its central point: How to avoid mechanistic and anthropomorphic interpretations of animal life and instead apprehend each creature’s unique way of being.

Gestures of a Life
A talk by Stephen L. Talbott (2021)

For more than 20 years, our senior researcher — Steve Talbott — has been building a body of work that illuminates natural phenomena and calls for a qualitative approach to examining organisms. In this talk, given at the Institute in November, 2021, Steve describes his theme as an offering of “notes from desperately unsatisfactory encounters with the living interior of self and world, along with intimations of their meaning for science.”

Henrike Holdrege on Georg Maier’s “Ways of Approaching Nature”
Henrike Holdrege in conversation with John Gouldthorpe

Inspired by the ancient Greek concepts of the four elements — Earth, Water, Air, and Fire — the German physicist Georg Maier wrote an essay in 1970 describing how we can work with these concepts to find expanded ways of scientific research and engagement with nature. Henrike Holdrege, co-founder of The Nature Institute, who translated Maier’s essay into English, speaks in this episode about his central ideas.

The Potter Wasp and Gene-centered Science
An excerpt from The Physical Mystery of Life by E.L Watson (1943), and an article “Genes and Life: The Need for Qualitative Understanding” by Craig Holdrege (1999)

This episode, aired in 2021, highlights two still highly relevant pieces in the premier issue of the institute’s publication, In Context #1 (Spring 1999). Host John Gouldthorpe reads a selection on the remarkable capacities of the female potter wasp, by E.L. Grant Watson, and an article by Craig Holdrege that reflects on the need to contextualize our understanding of genes in relation to the whole organism.

Seeing the Animal Whole — And Why It Matters
A talk by Craig Holdrege (2021)

In this talk given by Craig at the online launch of his new book, he shares experiences and observations that demonstrate an integrative practice of viewing animals and their development. Ultimately it is about a different way of relating to nature. A sensitive way. And that matters.

Resonant Space — A Goethean Approach to Understanding
A talk by Jon McAlice (2021)

In this talk, educator Jon McAlice speaks about Resonant Space as a consciousness experience that is alive and meaningful. He outlines Goethe’s approach to engaging with the world of phenomena as a path that lets us glimpse the resonant relationship that exists between human consciousness and the natural world.

Thinking Like A Plant
Host John Gouldthorpe talks with Craig Holdrege, director of The Nature Institute, about Craig's book, Thinking Like a Plant: A Living Science for Life.

Plants are dynamic and resilient, thriving in intimate connection with their environment. Craig’s book presents an organic way of knowing modeled after the way plants live.

Cultivating the Roots of Earth Stewardship
A talk by Craig Holdrege (2018)

How can we help our children grow up to become caring and responsible stewards of the earth, and what is the role of media and direct experience in the education we provide them? These are some of the questions that Craig Holdrege takes up in this talk that he gave on March 24th, 2018, at the Winkler Center for Adult Education in Garden City, NY.

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In Dialogue With Nature features talks and readings on topics from our ongoing research. Subscribe to our podcast, follow us on Instagram, or join our mailing list to receive news of our latest podcast episode.